This episode of the c-suite podcast was produced in partnership with Randstad, the world’s largest HR services company. We discussed Workmonitor 2025, Randstad’s flagship research that captures the voice of talent through insights from over 26,000 individuals across 35 global markets. Russell Goldsmith was joined in our London studio by Vicky Short, CEO of Randstad UK David Vincent, Managing Director of Randstad Enterprise EMEA Josh Willacy, Senior Lead, EDI, Randstad UK, Ireland and Enterprise EMEA Francesca Profeta, CCWP, a research analyst at the Staffing Industry Analysts (SIA) Our guests discussed the findings of the report and explored how organisations can bridge the gap between evolving talent, expectations and employer strategies. Full transcript Russ: [00:00:06] Welcome to the latest episode of the c-suite podcast that we’re producing in partnership with Randstad, the world’s largest HR services company. My name is Russell Goldsmith, and on today’s show, we are diving into Workmonitor 2025, Randstad’s flagship research that captures the voice of talent through insights from over 26,000 individuals across 35 global markets. Joining me in the London studio to discuss the findings of the report and explore how organisations can bridge the gap between evolving talent, expectations and employer strategies, are Vicky Short, CEO of Randstad UK, David Vincent, Managing Director of Randstad Enterprise EMEA, Josh Willacy, Senior EDI lead across Randstad EMEA and then finally Francesca Profeta, a research analyst at the Staffing Industry Analysts. Thank you all for joining me in the studio. Vicky, let’s start with you now. Now, I found this first stat on the Workmonitor report really interesting. Because it highlights that for the first time, a work life balance surpasses pay as the leading motivator for talent. So how do you see that shift impacting talent attraction and retention strategies for leaders in 2025? Vicky: [00:01:20] Yeah, absolutely. And it’s not really a surprise. It’s a trend that’s been growing. And we see in ‘25, the workplace is changing faster than ever. We’re in a talent scarce market. Employees are asking for more than the payroll. They’re looking for flexibility. They’re looking for personalisation in the workplace, and they’re looking for purpose. And these aren’t just nice to haves anymore, employers really have to think about how to be more meaningful in that. And in this year’s Workmonitor, we see that 51% of UK employees wouldn’t accept a job without flexibility around working hours. And this isn’t just about young people anymore. Gen Z is just above that statistic with 53%. So, it’s actually about all age groups in the workforce looking for that flexibility to keep them engaged in, in the workplace. And you know, we’ve also seen that about 43% of employees would actually leave work due to a toxic work environment. So, it’s not just about the flexibility, but it’s about the culture and the environment that employers are creating as well. Employers need to think about how they personalise that and it’s tough in a large company, or in any company actually, to create that personalisation at scale in your company. But actually, personalisation really creates trust in your employees. And 57% of people said that they would leave an organisation because of the trust. So, there’s some real things that employers need to think about; how they create these sorts of things to be not just attractive to new employees, but to retain the talent in their organisations. Russ: [00:03:06] Can you give an example of where a company has brought that into action? Vicky: [00:03:09] Yeah, sure. One of our clients, Jaguar Land Rover, has really thought about how they do this purposely. And they’re a large employer, global brand. And they’re really keen to go beyond the fact that their brand attracts talent to them anyway. But really thinking about how do we do this outside of perhaps roles where it’s easier to create flexibility in the offices, but they’ve looked at that in their production environments, their engineering environments where they’ve looked at their shift patterns, creating more flexibility there. And that’s made it more accessible for females to join, where they wanted to get a better gender balance. Now they’re attracting more women to not just apply for work but actually being able to perform that work because there’s more flexibility in the shift patterns. Russ: [00:03:55] Fran, let’s bring you in. Any significant differences between gender on the question about what would keep them in their current employment? Fran: [00:05:36] Yeah. So, we’ve done some work at SIA with the Women in Business Collaborative. And when we look at retention strategies, we asked a slightly different question. So, it’s obviously not the same. But which of the following potential improvements would significantly reduce your likelihood of leaving your employer. And the number one thing that women quoted was pay came first, and that could be down to many different things. We know that it takes longer for women to get promoted. We know that there’s obviously a gender penalty gaps, motherhood penalty gaps and all those kind of things. So, pay generally meant that that’s one thing that they were interested in in order to keep them in their role. And then second came career progression. But we see similar things with our survey when we survey buyers of large contingent workforce programs. The organisations that we would call leaders versus laggards do have broad strategies relating to improved technology, better maturity of their program. And what they do have is better alignment of their contingent workforce programs to diversity goals. And in doing so, they have better talent attraction retention and just generally return on investment. So, we are definitely seeing the same thing. Obviously, they haven’t seen the data split by gender for Randstad. But I’m sure as we say, this is such an important thing that’s come through on this on this survey. Russ: [00:05:31] Sure. Vicky, one thing I wanted to ask as we’re seeing a lot of companies pushing for full time return to the office. I’ve actually got a personal interest in this because my company is totally remote. But reported on BBC News website earlier this month it was off the BBC’s Panorama show. So, you had Lord Rose, the former chief executive of Marks and Spencer and former chair of Asda. He said that homeworking was part of the UK economy’s general decline and employees productivity was suffering. How was that reflected in these results? Vicky: [00:06:03] I think, overall, we see there’s a disconnect between what the bosses want and leadership want versus the talent in the workplace. And I think this is one of the main conundrums organisations need to think about is, who do you want to be? And even if you’re a really great employer brand, you’re a real magnet for talent. You’re not necessarily going to get the diversity. As Fran said, you’re not necessarily going to get the best talent wanting to come and work for you if you’re super rigid on people being in the office five days a week. We actually see that sort of a fixed hybrid approach tends to work for both leadership and talent, and that tends to be something that’s attractive to people because they have that certainty – I’m in the office three days a week, that can work for me. I can work out my childcare or my social life around that. But that five days rigidity is really impacting on employers’ ability to attract top talent, but also diverse talent into their organisations. So, whilst I think it’s great for the headlines and it’s great to get out there and there are challenges with managing productivity and how you upskill your managers to manage a hybrid workforce; manage that productivity when you’re not looking at your talent all of the time and getting beyond that presenteeism. But there’s lots of examples of employers who have fully remote workforces like yourself that are super successful. And certainly, that fixed hybrid approach tends to be where we see most employers land. And that generally works for both employees and them. Russ: [00:07:45] Great. David, let’s bring you into the discussion. How should employers approach the challenge of upskilling their workforce, particularly when we’re seeing AI and other emerging technologies transforming industries? David: [00:07:57] Yeah, I think it’s a great question. It’s a really hot topic at the moment, and we’re seeing that skilling and development is a prerequisite for employees now. When you look at some of the stats that we’ve pulled through in the latest report, 44% of employees that we spoke to said that they wouldn’t accept a role if they felt that the skilling and development opportunities weren’t where they expected them to be. But I think more importantly than that, if you look at the stats that we’ve got about people and their willingness to actually leave the role that they’re currently working in, we’ve seen a huge increase in that regarding skilling. So, if people feel that they’re not getting the right level of development or skilling, 41% of those individuals are prepared to walk away from the role that they’re in. And that’s up from 29% last year. So, it’s a big increase. You can see there’s this growing momentum of importance around the whole skilling and development piece for sure. Russ: Okay. David: And I think employers definitely recognise that. We see that 90% of the employers we spoke to recognise and agree that they’ve got some responsibility to deliver this skilling and development for their people. But I think what’s worrying is that 58% of them actually don’t know how to do that. So, there’s a bit of a gap there that we need to address for sure. But I think progress is definitely being made. 64% of the employees feel that their employer is helping them to develop future ready skills like AI and so on. And that again, that’s an uptick from last year. So, we are seeing some positivity there for sure. Russ: [00:09:34] Given the ridiculous pace that AI is developing. How challenging is it for employers to keep up with that and to keep that training at that pace? David: [00:09:46] Yeah. I think we can’t have any kind of conversation without talking about AI at the moment, can we? For sure. And if you look at the number of AI roles that we’ve seen, that’s grown fivefold between ‘23 and ‘24. So there’s this huge demand for these skills. And you layer that over what we’re seeing in terms of talent scarcity issue that we’re still seeing in the UK at the moment. There’s clearly employers have got to do something about this to try and close that gap. And they’re definitely recognising that. They’re recognising that they’ve got to spend time and invest in upskilling their own talent. But I think what’s important is when you look at the training and development that’s being done, it’s not equal, it’s not accessible in the same way to everybody. And, we see big gaps in gender. So, if you look at the current batch of AI workers, 71% of those are male, which is clearly disproportionate. And we see a similar thing across the generations where Gen X, 29% feel that they’ve got access to training and development around AI. Whereas if you look at baby boomers, it’s only 22% of that population feel they’ve got access. David: [00:11:00] So I think if organisations are really going to close that talent gap, they’ve got to close those discrepancies between those different groups. And I think that can be done by really targeted and personalised training programs. And we’ve seen that work ourselves at Randstad Sourceright. One of our clients is a global IT organisation. And they use the Randstad RiseSmart coaching across all of their population. And that focuses on providing really personalised training programs for individuals and looks at how it can encourage internal mobility, career pathing and upskilling. And what we see there is some really interesting stats actually, that individuals that go through that training program, 96% of them are saying that they want to spend two or more years with the organisation. So, we’re seeing that these highly personalised training programs, they don’t just upskill people, but they also bring a level of loyalty and engagement from your staff. So, it’s a win win for both parties there for sure. Russ: [00:12:10] Josh. Josh: [00:12:10] Just to add on to that, I think when we’re thinking about how we’re future proofing businesses in this kind of technological revolution, we need to think about who’s being upskilled. But also, what roles are being made most vulnerable. And we need to put an ED&I lens on that and upskill accordingly. And I think when we do try and take an equitable approach to AI skilling, we are more likely to have a future where we are bringing a diverse group of people along with us. And also, I think as we’re talking about AI next to it, there’s also, I think we saw an 81% surge in the human based skills around empathy, ethical, rationalisation, those human based interactions. And I think as we see more AI and automation, those skills will remain critical. So, who is really afforded the training opportunities, something we constantly need to be aware of and thinking about what demographics are most likely to receive them and who’s most vulnerable. Vicky: [00:13:12] I think it goes beyond who’s afforded them. It’s also at the moment, what we’re seeing is there’s more men self-selecting to upskill than women. So actually, it’s about how you get the level of engagement. So, it’s not necessarily around accessibility, it’s more around how you’re encouraging or enforcing – I don’t really want to use that term, that you’ve got that equitable approach. Because otherwise if it becomes self-selecting, we’re not going to tackle that issue. So, it’s got to be purposeful around how we do that as employers. David: [00:13:47] I think that’s where the data is really important, isn’t it? Because you can use the data to target the underrepresented groups and make sure that everybody is being included? I think that’s really important. Fran: [00:13:57] I think just to add a little bit of colour around this, like the report, the Workmonitor report came out just as the Future of Jobs report came out by the WEF. So, it really complements what you guys are doing and what you were saying. And also, data that SIA has produced previously. So, the scale of upskilling and reskilling is not a small thing. So, by 2030, if the workforce was of 100 people 59 would need complete retraining. So, this is a big task, and it is obviously the biggest significant barrier to business transformation for employers. So, they quote that as 63% saying, we can’t progress because we’re having these skilling problems. But the area I am slightly concerned about, and the evidence does point to that way is the widening gap of inequality through digital transformation. So, if we look at the fastest growing jobs of the future, they’re around areas such as data specialists, fintech engineers, machine learning, AI specialists, where women only have between 22%, maybe 28% of those roles. On the reverse, the roles that are in decline are generally held by women. They have up to 85 to 97% and their clerical roles secretarial roles. So, we’re seeing this disproportion of work, and the roles of the future being in decline. And those that are increasing, but also the remuneration of those roles. So, there’s a big gap between that. And it does seem to cause a further occupational segregation, not because of the skills, but also of the industries that women tend to work in. And we see this not only in AI, but we can see this in green jobs of the future and stuff like that. So, I think for businesses, this disruption should really be seen as an opportunity. We’re not going to change economic industrialisation and change the pay per industry. That does seem to be something that is going to be a bit far-fetched. But what we can do is ensure that we are reskilling and upskilling and training and being as inclusive as we possibly can while going through this transition, for sure. Russ: [00:16:12] Fran, let’s stick with you then. We’ve got economic uncertainty and shifting political opinions, particularly with Trump back in The White House. What impact do you think this will all have on ED&I efforts in 2025, and how can organisations sustain progress? Fran: [00:16:25] Yeah, so that’s a really small question. So, thanks for giving me that one. I think to put some colour on it, we are working in a real complex, multifaceted working environment, aren’t we? We’ve got economic uncertainty. There’s more wars now than there has been since the Second World War. I think there was quoted as 97 countries are actually in conflict at the moment. Climate change what is the biggest risk to the world over the last two years, and this was data that was released by the WEF risk report. Misinformation and disinformation was the highest risk. And you can see, although they put this as a technical issue, it’s not really a technical issue because it really does permeate into society as well. And you can see how quickly that has done that, probably within the diversity, equity and inclusion framework. Obviously, you’d have to be living under a rock to not know that Trump has put forward an executive order to end diversity programs within the federal government. And, I have been receiving messages already. How does this impact our organisation? Well, we’re really not too sure yet, to be honest with you. Fran: [00:17:41] But with that going on, it’s still really positive that 83% of organisations do have a diversity initiative in place. And none such more than in North America, 96% of organisations have this. So, although we’re saying that Trump’s bringing out this orders and it’s going to be a negative thing overall, the stats do tell us that a lot of organisations do have diversity initiatives in place, and I’m sure that they might have some realignment. They might be changing their wording, they might be changing, removing quotas, things like that, but they are widespread and very popular. So yeah, for sure there might be some realignment. But the evidence is there. The Workmonitor data that Randstad obviously just produced says that 55% of employees would quit if they didn’t feel they belonged. 62% believe equality initiatives do make a difference to their organisation And as Vicki said, they’re not just threatening to leave, they are actually leaving. So, we do have to take this as a real considerable threat. So, your clients are telling you how important it is. We survey, SIA funny because we’re a research company, but we do our programs of your buyers. So, these are large organisations that have big programs in place. Biggest employers in the world. And when we say to them, so what are your workplace strategies? 63% have a program for diversity moving into, and then we also like to know what are you going to move into for the next two years. 28% saying we’re going to move that way as well. 53% have a program to encourage candidate diversity moving into the next two years, 33%. So, it’s not something that’s going away. And what is big is and something that really should be noted is that it’s not only for their full time employees or their employees with the organisation, it’s actually moving into contingent space. So, their entire workforce and 43% of companies will be looking into that over the next two years. So, it’s not something that we’re seeing as going away. Your employers want it. Your clients want it. Staffing companies such as Randstad, if they’re leaders in this space, we know through the business case that we’ve done for diversity, equity, inclusion in staffing does say that they outperform their peers in areas such as win rate, access to talent, and overall talent, but also their internal staff, they attract better internal staff. And in this environment where there’s constant change, constant disruption, having a great workforce is definitely going to be your competitive advantage as an organisation for sure. Vicky: [00:20:30] Yeah. So, I think these days it goes beyond us having to justify a business case. I think that’s something, ten years ago, we were talking a lot about the business case for ED&I. But actually, organisations are really recognising, as Fran just said, it’s a competitive advantage. It helps you secure the right talent into your business. In a skills scarce market, it’s critical that you tap into all the available talent pools that are around there. But also, we see in companies P&Ls, those organisations that have strong ED&I initiatives, inclusive workforces – it shows in the numbers, in terms of their top line growth, outperforming their peer group in terms of their profitability. So, it’s also good for shareholders. And increasingly we’re seeing in large global organisations this is becoming a KPI and compensation in executive pay as well. So companies are really taking this seriously and putting their money where their mouth is. Fran: [00:21:28] I think just to add one more thing before, we have the next biggest thing that’s impacting all of our organisations now and worldwide, especially in Europe and Japan, is demographics. By 2030, 1 in 6 people will be over the age of 60. And according to the Workmonitor data, 47% highlight the potential for expanded talent availability to tap into diverse and equitable talent. So, it’s not just a nice to have or let’s do this. It’s an imperative because we are running out of people, and we need to find candidates in diverse places and make sure that they’re right for the organisation. So, what are we doing for women through menopause? They’re going to be the fastest demographic in the workforce over the next few years. Another big area that is really being highlighted just recently is youth unemployment. So, NEET, not in employment, education or training. In the UK alone, that’s 550,000. So, these things we don’t only need to be thinking about, you know, millennials and this that, we need to be thinking about everybody and how we can include everybody in this area. Russ: Josh. Josh: [00:22:44] Yeah. And I just think that this uncertainty when it comes to demographics, when we’re thinking about sustainability, organisations really need to be thinking about being innovative when we’re trying to address talent scarcity. And I think organisations that are ahead of the curve understand what their business needs, but also understand what talent want. 59% of people in the Workmonitor said that they felt their organisation could be doing more around ED&I. And so, there’s definitely a want from talent. There’s an understanding from businesses. And so, I think whilst language and approaches may shift and change, organisations will continue to be innovative to make sure that there’s diversity of thought experience in the workplace so that they’re able to future proof and be sustainable in the long run. David: [00:23:46] Yeah, I think that’s the key point there. It’s not going to be a choice anymore. It’s going to be an imperative for organisations to be able to succeed moving forward. There’s no question about that. Russ: [00:23:56] I want to move on to one of the other key themes that emerged throughout the Workmonitor research. And that was community. So, Josh, it would be good to understand how organisations can foster what we would describe as authentic relationships across the employee journey. Josh: [00:24:14] Yeah, I mean, community is a big theme that came through this year. People are really interested in not just what they do, but how they do it and who they do it with. 85% of respondents in the Workmonitor said that actually they perform better when they feel a sense of community with their colleagues. And I thought what was really interesting is 36% said that they would take a pay cut if it meant having friends or having friendship connections with, with their colleagues. That was particularly the case with Millennials and Gen Z. And I think we can’t underestimate the impact of Covid. An increase in hybrid and remote working, in fostering real connections. And there’s a clear need to need to really feel a sense of something, being part of something bigger. And I think that organisations have to think about the digital tools to create a greater sense of connection. And just going back to what you were saying, Francesca, like from a contingency perspective and temporary workers, that sense of community is also just as important. And people are really investing time and energy into that. Josh: [00:25:21] But community also means showing up as yourself. And I think something that really stuck out to me, which was interesting, is 62% of respondents said that they are hiding an element of themselves at work, which has gone up from 55% last year. So, we’re seeing an increase in people not bringing their whole selves to the working environment. And so, we need to think about what the root of community, it’s that common unity. And I think we do that by sharing stories by, our network groups or ERGs. They’re the kind of things that allow people to be themselves and show up in the working environment. And really, talent looks at that when they are looking for a job. That’s one of the first things. Am I going to be able to show up as my authentic self? Will my needs be met? Will this fit around my life? And I think a big part of the work that we do is working with organisations to really get that message out from recruitment and into onboarding and beyond. Russ: [00:26:22] Can you give an example of where maybe a company or where you’ve worked with a company to bring to life the values that they claim to have? Josh: [00:26:29] Yeah, for example, a large construction company that we’ve worked with for a while, we really have done a lot of different open days with women from that organisation who have spoke to potential talent and really shared their journeys, what it’s like for them day to day. And we’ve done that also with ex-military personnel. And so that is creating a really clear vision of the communities that are in place. And it’s had a huge impact on application rates and retention because people can physically see this is actually where I could fit in. This is actually a pathway to career progression where I can show up authentically as me. And so, I think really, the earlier you can share that those communities have been fostered within your organisation, the greatest success you can have. Vicky: [00:27:18] I think as well on that. That’s a great example, Josh, but I think it’s also about allyship there, where you have where you are underrepresented, and you don’t necessarily have the role models to showcase. It’s also about that allyship and advocacy that really makes people feel safe, makes people feel like there are those opportunities that could be a great option for them in the workforce because there is a see it to believe it. But then you also need to create an environment when they do join an organisation that they feel like they’re safe, that they belong, and that they have that opportunity. And that’s often a mistake that employers make, is they’ll attract the talent into the organisation and then it’s almost like a boomerang. They leave because they don’t feel the sense of community, they don’t feel like they belong. And so, it’s also about really thinking about how you use the network in the organisation to create that space for people. Josh: [00:28:19] And I think that’s where leaders really can act as sponsors, as mentors. That’s where it’s really important to be visibly showing an understanding of communities, even if you do not belong to them. And it’s something that I know Randstad spend a lot of time on. We’ve got various mentorship programs. We’re launching our Allyship Academy this year. We talk about different points of identity. But I think leaders need to be proactive in that so that there is that retention and there isn’t that kind of immediate boomerang. Fran: [00:28:50] I definitely agree with that. We do many events and when we do, maybe a round table event, I’ll be sat there and there’ll be a table full of women that will come and sit down and I’ll say, well, why did you come and sit at this table? And there is that relationship and that tribe. I’ve had loads of people come up and say, I just thought this looked friendly here. So, I just wanted to sit here and I’m like, great, that’s great. Come and join us. But equally I get men that come and sit at the table. So, I really want to involve my workforce. I want to be inclusive as possible, but only the guys want training. They’ll only come to me and ask for mentorships. They’ll only approach me. So, then you have to turn it around and say, well, okay. Do you approach when maybe your staff and say, look, I think you’re great, why don’t I mentor you? And they just have to try and think about things in a slightly different way to ensure that everybody is given that opportunity. So, it’s definitely leadership would be key in this area for sure. Josh: [00:29:45] 100% David: [00:29:45] I think one of the interesting things listening to everybody talking is, there’s clearly this movement of people being more prepared to vote with their feet now. We talked about it with flexibility and the hybrid working community, upskilling and so on and so forth. And I think that’s going to be something that we’re going to see come to fruition over the next couple of years, for sure. Josh: [00:30:04] Just one last thing on purpose as well. We often think about our internal communities of colleagues. But what’s really becoming important to people is where do they fit in terms of the communities around them, whether it’s locally or wider, from a citizenship perspective. And so, something that we’ve been able to do is build community through our partners, through opportunities to volunteer. So, working with the likes of Inside Connections, Restart, Mumsnet and through our teams, we’re building connections more broadly to bring in new talent, but also to make a significant impact in in the world around us. And I think we’re seeing a much bigger shift in terms of priorities. How am I making an impact? How am I making positive change in the world around me? And so, I think we need to think about community internally, but also what are we doing externally and how can we engage our staff in that? Vicky: [00:31:02] I think on that it’s got to be real, because one of the mistakes organisations make is they have this public image on the website of our purpose; who we are; the communities and then people join the organisation and they’re like, where on earth is this? It doesn’t exist. And so, it’s got to be really authentic there, so that you’re living and breathing what your public image is. And I think on that as well, that sort of sense of purpose and community and the partnerships -, if you’re an organisation that relies on public sector funding and you might be a private organisation, but you rely on, if you’re one of these big construction companies in infrastructure, you bid for government work – you’ve got to not just say it, you’ve got to do it and measure it and showcase it. Whether it’s ED&I initiatives, whether it’s your partnerships, whether it’s how you’re impacting on the community, these things are all linked together and you’re being purposely measured. So, your organisation’s success now absolutely relies on – if you want to win this work, if you want to grow your organisation and be successful, your customers or the people who are spending money with you are going to expect you to do this. Whether you’re a retailer, whether you’re bidding for government framework work, etc. they expect you to be doing it. Josh: [00:32:26] Yeah. And I think customers are more savvy as well. Because they heard the corporate lines, but they really want to see impact and action. So yeah, I think that authenticity is key. Russ: [00:32:36] This is great. You’re clearly passionate about this. This conversation could go on all morning. Vicky, there’s another area that the report focussed on that I wanted to look at. It highlighted a gap in trust between staff and leadership. Which I would say is highly concerning. What steps can leaders therefore take to rebuild that trust whilst strengthening ED&I. Vicky: [00:32:58] There’s quite a number of different areas leaders can look at. I think if you look at the statistics 52% of employers said that they would quit the job if they didn’t trust their boss. So again – how do I retain the best talent in my organisation? This is a business imperative. And if you look at the stats a bit further, about a third of people say that they believe their manager doesn’t have their best interests at heart, and about a third of people think they feel unsupported by their boss. So, there’s a real connection here between that sort of sense of belonging and what bosses and leaders need to look like. So, they want to look at, where is the walking the talk in the organisation? So how are you creating equity and opportunity for people? How are you bringing people along and creating that openness? And as Fran said, it’s not just about saying, ‘oh, well, we’ve created this and anybody can apply’. You’ve also got to be more purposeful and go beyond that and make that connection with people and bring people who are less confident in the workplace, don’t feel as confident to step up if they’re it might be women, it might be people from an ethnically diverse background who don’t necessarily have the confidence to step up into that opportunity to do training or into a more senior role because they’re not represented in that already. Vicky: [00:34:17] You’ve got to be thinking about – how are you helping your managers have the skills of empathy, of really caring about your staff, taking a true interest in them and supporting them to step up. And that’s got to be personalised. So, it’s got to be, how do I make people feel safe to be vulnerable and open up about how they’re feeling? How do I really show an interest in them as an individual and help be a cheerleader for them? How do I maybe get them a mentor? It might be an ally, get some coaching in place for them. It’s got to be really quite active. And that’s when people start to build that trust, because rather than just having a 1 to 1 conversation and you’ve discussed it in the room and then you might have made some notes if you’re lucky, and off you go. You’re actually doing something about it when you go out of the room, and you advocate for them actively. So, I think leaders now have to go beyond that sort of extra mile. But really think about – what are you interested in? What do you really want in life? How am I creating a space for you to be really honest with me about what I’m doing well for you? But also how I can improve to get the best out of you while you’re in work? Fran: [00:35:32] But it brings the two points together quite perfectly, though, doesn’t it? Like your sense of community and your sense of trust when you see the data and that trust is lacking, and I think one of your taglines is who am I doing it with? Believe it or not, your manager is a part of that. So, you need to/they need to be in a position to bring you along for the ride. Like we’re going to be doing this together. This is something that we’re really interested in and we’re going to progress in this way. So, the community, the belonging and the trust really does go together. Vicky: [00:36:09] And I think as well, if you think about how we talked about remote working earlier, that’s tougher to do in a remote environment. How do I really connect with somebody when I’m not seeing them in person, and I’m not having the chat over at the coffee machine or that sort of thing? So again, if you’re a leader of a remote workforce or a hybrid workforce, how am I building that personal connection? Really showing that interest and how am I advocating for them when I don’t see them and we’re not working in the same office all of the time? So, I think that’s something that we really need to think about. And there’s a massive opportunity there as well to help build that confidence in your workforce so that people trust you and therefore they’re more likely to, if you’re going through a change program, they’re more likely to come with you on that journey through the change because they’ve got your back. They trust you. They know you’ve got their back as well. So, particularly, there’s lots of change coming. We’ve talked about that, with AI and technology changes. Building that trust in your workforce means you’ll build loyalty, but you’ll get the change in transition you want as leaders. David: [00:37:17] Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that change now is going to be persistent, isn’t it. Yeah. That’s just going to be BAU for lots and lots of organisations. And I think you’ve got to be transparent with your people about where you’re aiming to go to. And I think transparency is the first step in building that trust. And that’s absolutely critical. Josh: [00:37:35] And I think it supports a sense of resilience. Because more often than not, people can feel detached from their leaders, from their working environment, both physically, but also, I guess in terms of how they’re communicating. And so, it’s more important than ever to really focus in on those connections, bringing people around, both formally but also informally with those regular check ins to build that strength, that sense of loyalty. And, I think that change is the constant. I think that’s something that we’ll continue to see. And so how do we create those regular touch points of communication to build trust. And are we doing that right across the board with everybody and not just those who we have an affinity with or those we are able to connect with more, more easily? Who are those people that perhaps fall through the cracks for whatever reason? And that’s why I think the leadership learning around empathy is so critical in the environment we’re in today. Russ: [00:38:35] Okay, I’ve got one final question for each of you. I’m going to go around the table and get a response on this one. We’re recording this at the end of January. So, looking ahead for the rest of 2025, what’s your one key piece of advice for leaders looking to build inclusive, resilient and future proof businesses? And Josh, I’m going to start with you. Josh: [00:38:56] I think for me it is really about that community building. I think it’s about ensuring that there’s connection between teams that we are building a sense of trust that there’s representation across, across the board and remembering that ED&I is we need to think of it rather as a long term strategy. And so, while there may be headwinds in relation to this work, we really do need organisations to continue engaging and committing to diversity and inclusion in order to kind of achieve success but also improve the working lives of staff and of colleagues. Russ: Fran? Fran: [00:39:33] I think for me, it’s around, I know you just mentioned it, but transparency, like we’re not perfect yet. 59% of respondents to the survey did say we could be doing more. And also, there is that detachment with psychological safety. A lot of people not bringing their true selves because they don’t feel safe enough to do that. So, what I feel leaders could do really is be completely transparent. We’re not perfect. This is our pay gap data. It’s not perfect, but we’re definitely working on it. This is our ethnicity data. It’s not perfect, but we’re definitely going to work on it. And this is what we’re doing in order to mitigate those, those things. So yeah, for me I think it’s transparency and communication. Bring everybody along on this journey. And it doesn’t happen overnight that there has to be funded. It has to have a plan. It has to be strategic. And it doesn’t happen overnight for sure. Russ: [00:40:29] David. David: [00:40:30] Yeah. So, I think for me, it’s about investing in your people alongside the investments you’re making in technology. There’s no point in having access to the best technology out there if your people don’t know how to use it. I think organisations have got to commit to upskilling. They’ve got to make sure that that’s available to everybody across the organisation. I think organisations that successfully integrate innovation, upskilling and inclusion are going to be the ones that succeed in 2025. Russ: [00:41:00] Vicky, we gave you the first word. I’ll let you have the final one. Vicky: [00:41:04] Thank you. My advice would be really lead with empathy and adaptability. I talked a lot about change today and as Josh said earlier, it is the only constant in life. Things are constantly changing. So, thinking about – employees are looking, not just looking for jobs, they are looking for communities. They’re looking to feel valued, to feel responsible. Thinking about how you can prioritise flexibility – we know that’s a key driver for people. Going beyond that, being in the office five days a week. For some organisations that’s the right strategy, but actually, if you want a successful workforce that is diverse, you’ve got to think differently around these sorts of things. Prioritising your staff’s wellbeing is critical, because we see again mental health – we’ve not talked about it today, but mental health and wellbeing is a core driver for colleagues. And if they feel like their employer cares about them and prioritises their wellbeing, again they’ll come and work for you and they’ll stay and they’ll be more productive coming back to what organisations are looking for. So really thinking about the culture you want to create in your organisation and being purposeful in terms of how you do that, but also making sure you lead by example, because culture starts with leadership. And people look to you as the CEO or the leader of that organisation to set the benchmark. So, it definitely has to start with you. Russ: [00:42:36] Perfect. Excellent responses from each of you on that final question. Thank you for that. That is where we are going to have to leave the discussion for today. So, Francesca Profeta, Josh Willacy, David Vincent and Vicky Short, thanks all for joining me again and for sharing your thoughts and insights. If you want to download the Workmonitor 2025 report, it’s available on Randstad’s website. Simply go to Randstad.co.uk/Workmonitor. We’ll also put a link to it in our show notes on the website, along with a link to additional research that Fran’s SIA team have available too. I hope you’ve enjoyed this episode. Please do follow us wherever you get your podcasts, and if you want to contribute to the discussion, you can find the c-suite podcast on LinkedIn and all the usual social channels. Finally, if you would like to get in touch with the show, you can do that via the contact form at csuitepodcast.com, but for now, from me, Russell Goldsmith, until next time, goodbye. In partnership with PRCA members receive 10 CPD points for listening to this podcast if they log it on their CPD programme. View episode
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